Ip-ISn : sk-dm-Im Fp sNtp
Category: Editorial Beat
Publish Date: Feb 28, 2013
Views: 17962
kallukadi : What do to become a Center Pastor.
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Displaying 11 Comments
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a. s. mathew (March 11, 2013)
What happend to the last part of my comment? (3)
What happend to the last part of my comment? (3)
+3
a. s. mathew (March 11, 2013)
contd: 2 was changed to "governor". the british government was not greatly concerned with the village or taluk administration in those days. the u.s. system of administration is moving in another direction. the "county" government at the lowest sector, then city government and then the state administration. the "county judge" is the ceo or the county, the mayor is the ceo of the city, then governor as the ceo of the state. the governor of a state in india is simply representing the central government without much say so in the state daily administration, but the u.s. governor holds the steering of the state administration. even though the indian churches like the pentecostal denominations of kerala are closely connected with the u.s. churches, in the administrative format, they were interested in the bristish system.
contd: 2 was changed to "governor". the british government was not greatly concerned with the village or taluk administration in those days. the u.s. system of administration is moving in another direction. the "county" government at the lowest sector, then city government and then the state administration. the "county judge" is the ceo or the county, the mayor is the ceo of the city, then governor as the ceo of the state. the governor of a state in india is simply representing the central government without much say so in the state daily administration, but the u.s. governor holds the steering of the state administration. even though the indian churches like the pentecostal denominations of kerala are closely connected with the u.s. churches, in the administrative format, they were interested in the bristish system.
+3
a. s. mathew (March 11, 2013)
I am not writing the commments with any intention to disrepect the Church administration of various denominations. Every denomination has their own format of administration based maily on the age old traditions. But the totally Bible-believing Churches, while they say that the total foundation of their doctrine and administration is the " Word of God", while these denominations act differently like the traditional Churches, then we are faced with some critical questions. The word " district " I couldn't find in the Bible. Neither village nor Taluk. The British bureaucracy is blindly followed in India, and only certain titles were re-named to look as if modern. Village executives were called "Parothiyar" but now it is called "village officer". The Taluk executive was named " Thahilsidar" now it is Taluk officer. But the District executive " Collector" is the same today. The State executive "Diwan"
I am not writing the commments with any intention to disrepect the Church administration of various denominations. Every denomination has their own format of administration based maily on the age old traditions. But the totally Bible-believing Churches, while they say that the total foundation of their doctrine and administration is the " Word of God", while these denominations act differently like the traditional Churches, then we are faced with some critical questions. The word " district " I couldn't find in the Bible. Neither village nor Taluk. The British bureaucracy is blindly followed in India, and only certain titles were re-named to look as if modern. Village executives were called "Parothiyar" but now it is called "village officer". The Taluk executive was named " Thahilsidar" now it is Taluk officer. But the District executive " Collector" is the same today. The State executive "Diwan"
+3
dr aby sa (March 11, 2013)
ordination gimmick in ipc is nothing but the real gimmick (meaning given in thefreedictionary.com: a device employed to cheat, deceive, or trick) done through bribery or nepotism. i remember when the top brass (i don't want to name him -one of the senior-most ministers of ipc) was asked to pray for the businessman son of another senior minister at the latter's residence, the first one laid his hands on the beneficiary and prayed. later on, it was interpreted as ordination by the latter two and the businessman son was made a centre minister at ranni about 15+ years ago. there are so many such non-resident ministers who acquire ordination through the backdoor. there are some 'agents' too who facilitate this job for wealthy ones (not worthy ones, note the point). many penniless but worthy ones are refused to be accepted as accredited ministers - what a contradiction. let the council or general body decide the candidates through fasting/prayers for the leading of the holy spirit.
ordination gimmick in ipc is nothing but the real gimmick (meaning given in thefreedictionary.com: a device employed to cheat, deceive, or trick) done through bribery or nepotism. i remember when the top brass (i don't want to name him -one of the senior-most ministers of ipc) was asked to pray for the businessman son of another senior minister at the latter's residence, the first one laid his hands on the beneficiary and prayed. later on, it was interpreted as ordination by the latter two and the businessman son was made a centre minister at ranni about 15+ years ago. there are so many such non-resident ministers who acquire ordination through the backdoor. there are some 'agents' too who facilitate this job for wealthy ones (not worthy ones, note the point). many penniless but worthy ones are refused to be accepted as accredited ministers - what a contradiction. let the council or general body decide the candidates through fasting/prayers for the leading of the holy spirit.
+3
a. s. mathew (March 10, 2013)
dr aby sa: what you have said is very true. i am not pinpointing any particular denomination; however, the wild march of the religious hierarchy totally composed of the divinely called ministers are totally hipped in creating more posts and positions, more districts and political order under the disguise of "administration". when we evaluate the outcome of this political game plan wrapped up in a religious outfit, we will wonder by the futility of the whole issue. more districts can be found in the denominational empire than the number of districts in a state with 100 times more population. so, there is no guesswork needed to fathom the ultimate ulterior motives behind this degraded and sub-standard drudgery; and the sole purpose is nothing but wordly positions. none of these leaders are interested in mass evangelism but only in the expanded administration! as you have concluded, the coming of the lord jesus is very close.
dr aby sa: what you have said is very true. i am not pinpointing any particular denomination; however, the wild march of the religious hierarchy totally composed of the divinely called ministers are totally hipped in creating more posts and positions, more districts and political order under the disguise of "administration". when we evaluate the outcome of this political game plan wrapped up in a religious outfit, we will wonder by the futility of the whole issue. more districts can be found in the denominational empire than the number of districts in a state with 100 times more population. so, there is no guesswork needed to fathom the ultimate ulterior motives behind this degraded and sub-standard drudgery; and the sole purpose is nothing but wordly positions. none of these leaders are interested in mass evangelism but only in the expanded administration! as you have concluded, the coming of the lord jesus is very close.
+3
dr aby, sa (March 10, 2013)
only money/muscle power used to rule the ipc realm. if any disgruntled candidate is not given the centre or area kingship, they are prepared to get downgraded to any level by creating their own centre within the centre; like splitting a political party for safeguarding their vested interests.a best example is the creation of vechoochira centre about 15 years ago. the scenes behind it are too foul-smelling. so i am not attempting to unveil any of them.'kozhiye kattavar ippol thalayil kozhippappu thappunnundaavum'.ever since, about a dozen new districts/areas have been created to lessen the headaches of the ipc leadership.it is high time to bulldoze the hierarchy of this areas and district business in all the congregations!it seems we are going back to square one.it is not even unheard of in other denominational churches! wake up from your purposeful slumber; all those in leadership, it is still not late to do some cleansing as the return of jesus christ is very close! god bless you.
only money/muscle power used to rule the ipc realm. if any disgruntled candidate is not given the centre or area kingship, they are prepared to get downgraded to any level by creating their own centre within the centre; like splitting a political party for safeguarding their vested interests.a best example is the creation of vechoochira centre about 15 years ago. the scenes behind it are too foul-smelling. so i am not attempting to unveil any of them.'kozhiye kattavar ippol thalayil kozhippappu thappunnundaavum'.ever since, about a dozen new districts/areas have been created to lessen the headaches of the ipc leadership.it is high time to bulldoze the hierarchy of this areas and district business in all the congregations!it seems we are going back to square one.it is not even unheard of in other denominational churches! wake up from your purposeful slumber; all those in leadership, it is still not late to do some cleansing as the return of jesus christ is very close! god bless you.
+3
thepraize (March 7, 2013)
@athomas : sir your thoughts are too idealistic, and thats the way it should be,however major organisations consciously ensure such detereminations happen for financial purposes.many regions are financially inadequate and the headquarters do not support,which leads to such decisions. nri district pastors or nri central pastor for the most part are well off and well paid in their secular functionalities and its a matter of self gratification under false pretence of kingdom building they enthusiastially venture into insane positions.this works good for all parties involved,with finances flowing in and the nri dp/cp given the dias to speak,even though it might be absolute insanity,poor faithfuls are happy,the church leadership is happy,everything went as per god's plan :)
@athomas : sir your thoughts are too idealistic, and thats the way it should be,however major organisations consciously ensure such detereminations happen for financial purposes.many regions are financially inadequate and the headquarters do not support,which leads to such decisions. nri district pastors or nri central pastor for the most part are well off and well paid in their secular functionalities and its a matter of self gratification under false pretence of kingdom building they enthusiastially venture into insane positions.this works good for all parties involved,with finances flowing in and the nri dp/cp given the dias to speak,even though it might be absolute insanity,poor faithfuls are happy,the church leadership is happy,everything went as per god's plan :)
+3
athomas (March 6, 2013)
will there be a change in ipc? in ipc many district/regional pastors live in different countries and they visit their district/region during the annual convention and preach a couple of sermon and go back. the district is run by their assistants. many district pastors have never visited many of their local churches in their district. when they come for holidays they will be busy preaching in other conventions. i wish if the new ipc admin will look into this and remove such visiting district/regional pastors and appoint able men of spirit, wisdom, integrity, eduction and those who live locally. it is also good if the district pastors will not serve as local pastors, but will visit the churches in their district on sundays and during week days to encourage the believers and pastors in their district and to help starting new outstations in their region. in ipc there are many senior pastors who hold multiple positions. they should accept one renounce the rest. can we expect a change?
will there be a change in ipc? in ipc many district/regional pastors live in different countries and they visit their district/region during the annual convention and preach a couple of sermon and go back. the district is run by their assistants. many district pastors have never visited many of their local churches in their district. when they come for holidays they will be busy preaching in other conventions. i wish if the new ipc admin will look into this and remove such visiting district/regional pastors and appoint able men of spirit, wisdom, integrity, eduction and those who live locally. it is also good if the district pastors will not serve as local pastors, but will visit the churches in their district on sundays and during week days to encourage the believers and pastors in their district and to help starting new outstations in their region. in ipc there are many senior pastors who hold multiple positions. they should accept one renounce the rest. can we expect a change?
+3
believer (March 2, 2013)
There should be some standard for giving ordination. Nowadays it is becoming like any body wants to be ordained, can be get it without much trouble. Christian ministry has to be done with God's GRACE. Money should not become a deciding factor. I know some became "President", even without ever being a Pastor of a local church.Money plays the trick. They have media coverage, and eventually they become saints.
There should be some standard for giving ordination. Nowadays it is becoming like any body wants to be ordained, can be get it without much trouble. Christian ministry has to be done with God's GRACE. Money should not become a deciding factor. I know some became "President", even without ever being a Pastor of a local church.Money plays the trick. They have media coverage, and eventually they become saints.
+3
sp (March 1, 2013)
when this kind of problem started in IPC long time ago, by ordaining evanchathists as Pastors, without any qualifications, the leaders were bribing money. When they become greedy, they started bribing for areas and districts. This will go on in IPC, for 1000 years after the second coming of Jesus. I am pretty sure.
when this kind of problem started in IPC long time ago, by ordaining evanchathists as Pastors, without any qualifications, the leaders were bribing money. When they become greedy, they started bribing for areas and districts. This will go on in IPC, for 1000 years after the second coming of Jesus. I am pretty sure.
+3
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may i conclude the last part of the comment, which was disappeared while transmitted. in the bible, at the apostolic time, the church administration was like the baptists-brethren pattern which we can witness in india. one day, when i met a pastor of a kerala pentecostal church, he introduced himself " i am the district pastor of so and so district". that introduction may change later on " i am the collector pastor or district rev or rev district in the future". more created positions and expanded areas will create greater frictions in the fellowship of the ministers and believers. how, he can be the pastor of many congregations in a district? is it a ministry or civil administration? it is high time that we must be totally focused on reaching out the world with the gospel of christ, and to be engaged in the "good samaritan ministry" of wiping the tears of the widows-orphans and discarded society. may god guide us all in that direction.